Ayinde you put forth several points, let me address them:
"In MY view, at the heart of identifying African in harmony with our ancestors (African centered) is MORAL VALUES. The BEST of my Ancestors did not define themselves along racial lines, although they had little need to."
More times the problem with the internet is that one can not type as fast as the brain moves and then one finds that they have typed 3 pages worth and still did not address all one intended to.
I hope what I say here address several of your questions at the same time. These are my thoughts:
For me, personally, it goes without saying that MORAL VALUES are greatly important in defining a person. I will explain for you that the difference between you and I is that I think AFRICAN first, whereas my perception of you is that you think EVERYONE first.
By this I mean that whenever I am speaking about a subject regarding redemption, regarding reparations, regarding repatriation, regarding organizing efforts to educate the masses, etc. the immediate image in my mind is PRO-ACTIVE, CONCERNED, SEEKING TO EDUCATE THEMSELVES, CONSCIOUS AFRICANS. It is these AFRICANS who will work to educate, stimulate all other Africans. It is these AFRICANS who, I would hope, through their own personal growth, have developed and/or maintained certain MORAL VALUES which are condusive to the creation of a more "positive" society. To me this is "higher" level thinking on terms of African Issues because I accept all Conscious Africans who demonstrate good MORAL VALUES; regardless of their religion, etc. etc.
At the same time, I am cognizant of the sleeping africans, the traitor africans, the power hungry, greedy, tyrant africans. But it is most boring to me, when I see certain ones (not you) come to me with that argument: that not all Africans are "righteous". I never once said that they are. But it is not because of the bad apples that I will forsake my cause.
Even in my personal life, I only work with those of MORAL VALUE. That goes without saying. But to me, the reason why I do not mention this issue is because MORAL VALUE goes without saying.
"I am for EQUAL OPPORTUNITY, which is the basis for defining JUSTICE.
Equal opportunity for me starts by correcting historical misinformation, which fuels the oppression of people. I am for compensating the victims and or the descendants of victims for injustices as a STEP towards leveling the economic playing field, which also serves to force acknowledgement of a serious crime against humanity."
For me, personally, on principle I agree with you. But where we disagree is when you put white people into the mix. Why? Because I personally feel that while there are a few good, well-meaning whites who are willing to work towards these efforts, I find it very hard to believe that the majority of those few well-meaning whites can ACCEPT, over an extended period of time, your pointing out to them the ills of their race. I personally feel that eventually the human ego can not take truthful accusations for too long without eventually lashing out. I see all the time, whites who agrees that lies have been purposefully planted and told and wrongs have been done, but they totally disagree with reparations. Yet one is dependent on the other. Reparations are demanding because of the wrong that's been done. What are the reasons for their disagreement on this? For these reasons I do not BELIEVE that extended working relationships with 90 + % of the FEW well-meaning.
An example: Your father, before you were born, did some heinous, ridiculously evil acts towards your families' next door neighbor; which damaged your neighbors property, killed some of the youth in the house, and maimed some of the elders. And because of what your father did, your family has been enriched for decades, while the neighbors family is fallen into decay, economic dispair, etc.
Here you come along 40 years later and after having been told about what your father did, you come to realize why plenty of those within your neighbor's family have extreme dislike/hatred towards you and your family. When you seek to repair the damage and you are confronted with the children's and the grandchildren's hatred and disgust for you, you may ovastand. You may tell them that as a well-meaning person, that you intend to try to work to make things better for them. Some of the children may come around, others may not come around, and will always remind you of what your father did. Even in repairing the neighbor's house, some may remind you at every step of the phase, "you see, this is where your father burned, etc." "you see, this is where your father planted a bomb" "you see, this is where your father, etc." The recounting details will continue until the entire house has been repaired. And after that when you work to repair some of the health issues of the family, you will begin to hear about how what your father did created this and that health problem.
Now you may be a patient man and be able to accept and take all of this; but my experience with Whites is that they are not able to withstand this for too long. I have seen in organizations, that things fall apart because hard feelings begin to develop with certain peoples. I have seen that certain concepts begin to be to reworded, reformed so that it is less damaging to "certain parties". etc. History has proven this.
Again, I would say that even amongst the few whites who Africans may be able to work with, only a few would be able to withstand and still support the movement from it's original purpose without seeking to change it.
It would take a great deal of space to repost the majority of your post, but I would say that, in principle I can agree with your summation:
"For example, if there are 100 Africans who understand the struggle, one White person and one Chinese person, then I am working with 102 persons all together instead of 100."
Yet, history has proven that there have been african traitors and most assuredly white enemies. History has also shown some whites who have done some good works for the African cause. Yet in this day and age, I do not want to be fooled. Africans, many times, have been led to be traitors based on the efforts of whites; whether it be US intelligence led efforts to disrupt movements or destabilize African govt's. I do not excuse the African but when you check the source, most times, the original culprit is very clear. These are my views.
I value your views very much and I hope you revisit your previous post in relation to all that I have commented on this board especially this thread. Although this statement “If you are, indeed, of Africa/An African descendent” may seem harmless it reeks of a negative attitude towards people who may be simply trying to elevate the discussion. I saw a similar statement in reference to someone that claimed to be a ‘Rasta’ who was simply trying to point out that sometimes some of the more informed Africans easily ‘take bait’. Later on you saw the point."
Ayinde forgive my harsh tone. Yet more and more I begin to be sickened by my own or in the case of the internet (where I can physically see no one so I assume they are MY own) who seem to be more interested in EMBRACING (some times literally) others that they neglect the most important cause (not referring to you particularly this is a general comment). When I read those words from you I began to wonder if you were indeed Black. Because this is what I've heard so much from whites. (Other things they say such as we all have the same blood running through our viens, we are all Africans, etc.)
I do not trust whites. I do not feel that I NEED to trust whites or NEED to be looking for "trustworthy" whites. Yet when I find one that 'seems' to be trustworthy, I treat them accordingly. And in this day and age, I don't see too many 'trustworthy' anybodies of any race; but whites, at least with them I am prepared. I want to free up Africans and I would hope that Native Indians would want to free up Native Indians from their situation, etc. etc. And I see nothing wrong with Race Pride because I do see differences in the races. Natural differences, much more than skin color.
As for the "baitors" comment: I feel that was sufficiently discussed in other threads where there is a need to combat a$$holes when necessary and then at other times there is a need to ignore them. But certainly when the comment is disrespectful, I will choose whether or not to respond dispectfully. "Are you a member of the Bait Takers Society?" whatever truth one "thinks" may be in that... there is a way to phrase it. So one must expect to get the same kind of response.
I find it amazing that some people sit back and enjoy the show of obvious spitefullness, make no comments, make no effort to reason the truth out of it, to bring "positivity" out of negativity; and yet find themselves able to come with smart a$$ comments to ones who are willing to put themselves out there. Now whether some think "putting themselves" out there was necessary is debatable.
Africans and African organizations have been derailed, delayed, become defunct and/or ineffective for far too long. Plenty mistakes have been made in the past; it is my opinion that we must learn from it.
It is my opinion that Africans must learn to love and value themselves and their abilities to DO for themselves. On the other side of the token I have been able to appreciate a few WHITES' comments such as some made by Blair, there was a Sis Alison who classified herself as white, yet made some very pertinent well placed comments. So perhaps I could associate in certain works with them; because the basics have been ovas and accepted.
My fingers are tired and I'm sure I wanted to say more but for now that is all.
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